Uncle
Berserker (7,565)
Feb 8, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Uncle on Jun 26, 2020 13:21:20 GMT -6
Little bit more info about King from PFF (almost exclusively a slot CB, but was set to go outside in 2020 for Chargers). He's also set to be an UFA after the 2020 season as the was drafted in 2017 in the 5th Rd, so he's looking to play outside CB for 2020, perform well and then cash-in. By the standards that King set across his first two seasons in 2017 and 2018, his performance last season was a disappointment (69.4 overall grade). That speaks more to just how high he set the bar, however. Across the 2017 and 2018 seasons, King ranked second among qualifying cornerbacks in PFF grade and sixth in PFF WAR, showing that slot cornerbacks can be some of the most valuable players on the football field. He has played almost exclusively in the slot, but that appears to be set to change this season with reports that Chris Harris Jr. will be playing in the slot for the Los Angeles Chargers next season. Depending on how things play out this season, King could be one of the more likely players on this list to hit the market in 2021. linkKing does not have ideal Zimmer-like outside CB size at only 5'10" tall, although he is 200 lbs so he's certainly not skinny (like Dantzler). I like it because we get someone on the last year of the rookie deal looking to make a splash (so he should be goin' all out), he has versatility to play inside and outside CB, we save on the 2020 cap (reducing Reiff's # while King is dirt-cheap for 2020) and it could possibly lead to a heavy front-loaded contract for Cook whereby we just take a bunch of guaranteed cap hit for Cook now and then it's not so bad for 2021+. Also, if King signs elsewhere in the 2021 offseason, we get the 2022 comp (could be a 3rd Rd, too, if he gets Waynes type FA money). The downside is we lose Reiff, but it's countered by the fact we kept Rashod Hill who can play LT in a pinch until Ezra Cleveland is ready to go mid-to-late season. I don't like the idea of O'Neill moving to LT - he's a solid RT so let's cement that spot and just use Hill and Cleveland at LT for 2020. It's a weak left side of the OL in 2020 unless somehow someone beats out Elflein for the LG job... ...but I do like the straight-up trade of Reiff for King - more upside than downside for the Vikes, for 2020 and beyond, IMO....
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OkieDokie
Surviving
Jarl (22,857)
Feb 5, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by OkieDokie on Jun 26, 2020 15:02:34 GMT -6
Yes, this would be a good trade
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Norseman
Thegn (3,074)
Apr 21, 2018
Valhalla
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Post by Norseman on Jun 26, 2020 16:26:22 GMT -6
thus flipping an area of strength for an area of need in the secondary. WTF? Since when was any part of our OL considered an "area of strength"
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OkieDokie
Surviving
Jarl (22,857)
Feb 5, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by OkieDokie on Jun 26, 2020 16:31:15 GMT -6
thus flipping an area of strength for an area of need in the secondary. WTF? Since when was any part of our OL considered an "area of strength" On paper
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Uncle
Berserker (7,565)
Feb 8, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Uncle on Jun 26, 2020 20:00:12 GMT -6
thus flipping an area of strength for an area of need in the secondary. WTF? Since when was any part of our OL considered an "area of strength" That was a quote included in the Fansided article. The premise of that particular quote was that the Vikings essentially have two LT's - Reiff and Cleveland. I'm willing to bet that the writer of the article isn't real knowledgeable about the Vikings OL "woes" and just sees Reiff (a league avg LT) and a 2nd Rd LT prospect and considers that an area of strength, not knowing how poor the LG next to Reiff is, or how the rookie C struggled in pass protection for the Vikings in 2019. Since I'm not a huge believer in the Vikings making a deep run in 2020 anyway, I like the deal actually. With trading Reiff's salary/cap for King's significantly smaller #, it may allow us to frontload a Cook extension - pushing as much money/cap into 2020 as possible and then the cap impact for 2021 may not be so bad. Plus, even if King walks in 2021, we would get a comp back in return and seeing as how it's likely we release Reiff in 2021 anyway, getting something back is better than eating dead cap in 2021. King would also prove somewhat of a "veteran" in the secondary that could allow Gladney, Dantzler and the young secondary to grow in 2020 and then take a leap in 2021.
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Post by Viking Horn on Aug 3, 2020 14:18:46 GMT -6
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Post by Viking Horn on Aug 6, 2020 12:22:42 GMT -6
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Uncle
Berserker (7,565)
Feb 8, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Uncle on Aug 6, 2020 12:27:24 GMT -6
Quick update on Winters: he signed w/ Buffalo shortly thereafter. Also, CB Darqueze Dennard - someone I thought the Vikings should consider as a vet CB this season - signed w/ Atlanta earlier this week, too. Details haven't been announced that I know of but I can't believe it would be something the Viking's couldn't have afforded, especially since they get a little relief from Pierce's pro-rated 2020 bonus amount of $2m.
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Uncle
Berserker (7,565)
Feb 8, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Uncle on Aug 12, 2020 19:06:19 GMT -6
So much for Everson makin' a return to Minnesota....I thought it would be good for him to play 3T to build on what he did during the Wild Card win in New Orleans where he penetrated inside and got pressure to Brees; alas, not to be....
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Odin
Purp1eOne
Winning
Jarl (15,175)
Feb 3, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Purp1eOne on Aug 12, 2020 19:22:50 GMT -6
Good for him I hope he got paid.
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WisconsinVike
I never felt so free - it was just my dog and me
Thegn (3,480)
Mar 3, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by WisconsinVike on Aug 13, 2020 0:33:18 GMT -6
So much for Everson makin' a return to Minnesota....I thought it would be good for him to play 3T to build on what he did during the Wild Card win in New Orleans where he penetrated inside and got pressure to Brees; alas, not to be....
Well that sucks!! The Vikings are gonna regret this.
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Uncle
Berserker (7,565)
Feb 8, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Uncle on Aug 13, 2020 6:25:35 GMT -6
Looking at Griffin's page in OvertheCap.com (OTC), it appears his deal w/ Dallas is 1-yr for $6m total - split between $3m for a base salary and $3m per game roster bonus ( link). Just as an FYI, OTC has the Vikings at $12m+ in cap space at the moment (with Pierce's opt-out taken into consideration)... linkThere were recent reports the Vikings did extend an offer to Griffin earlier this offseason and then tried again in the past week or two, w/ Zimmer getting involved per Ben Goessling:
I know the Vikings had a bit of uncertainty where their 2020 cap # was going to be during the beginning part of FA after they extended Cousins and tagged Harris, but I gotta believe that $6m was in the range of what the Vikings were offering back then and then I gotta believe with the space we had after Pierce's opt-out that we had to have been offering something along the lines of what he signed for with Dallas ($3m base salary w/ an add'l $3m in roster bonuses). To me, with Zimmer getting involved and the Vikes not being able to seal the deal w/ Griffin, this speaks volumes about what Everson thinks of the Viking's chances in 2020...it's clear he wants a ring and he went to one of the best rosters in the NFL that's now under the helm of Mike McCarthy....he chose that vs. the familiarity of Zimmer, Patterson and the team that stuck with him through his mental breakdown... Doesn't give Viking fans any warm-n-fuzzies about a deep playoff run and possible NFC Conference/Super Bowl contender this season....I personally didn't think the Vikings were setup for that regardless of whether Griffin was here or not, but this pretty much cements that, in my opinion...the 2020 season will be like Zimmer's 1st year in 2014: building up the youth to see what we have, and that's the disappointing thought to me because we've ridden the Mike Zimmer train before and we know exactly where it goes - not to Valhalla.... EDIT: the other "stinging" effect from Griffin choosing Dallas over Minnesota, is that since Griffin signed so late, the Vikings will not get any compensatory pick for him in 2021. The deadline for free agent signings to count towards a 2021 compensatory pick to the former team was 4/27/20. Everson did opt-out of his deal w/ Minnesota to make himself an UFA so the Vikes would have been in-line to possible receive one if he signed a halfway decent deal w/ someone before 4/27/20....
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Odin
Purp1eOne
Winning
Jarl (15,175)
Feb 3, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Purp1eOne on Aug 13, 2020 10:08:47 GMT -6
Uncle, I'll take your view if the Vikings would have signed him for the same contract I think while Griffen would have helped the team because he still has something left in the tank and he is familiar with the system, and with a shortened off-season that will be a factor, they may have been better off letting the younger guys play this year to build the team going forward. The Vikings defense was already on the decline last year with a younger version of Griffen and more proven CBs even though they had a down year. With the Vikings going the youth movement route for many of the other positions on the D and while Griffen is still effective he will probably take a step back from last year which he wasn't as dominate as the previous year. Factoring in the possible injury increase because of his age and a position where he is in the trenches on almost every play the money could have been spent in other places to help the team for the future.
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Uncle
Berserker (7,565)
Feb 8, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Uncle on Aug 13, 2020 10:18:55 GMT -6
Uncle , I'll take your view if the Vikings would have signed him for the same contract I think while Griffen would have helped the team because he still has something left in the tank and he is familiar with the system, and with a shortened off-season that will be a factor, they may have been better off letting the younger guys play this year to build the team going forward. The Vikings defense was already on the decline last year with a younger version of Griffen and more proven CBs even though they had a down year. With the Vikings going the youth movement route for many of the other positions on the D and while Griffen is still effective he will probably take a step back from last year which he wasn't as dominate as the previous year. Factoring in the possible injury increase because of his age and a position where he is in the trenches on almost every play the money could have been spent in other places to help the team for the future. To be clear, I only wanted him back to play along the interior because I do agree that I want Odenigbo (ie, younger players) to get the lion's share of the DE reps opposite Hunter. I really thought Zimmer found something in having Griffin rushing from inside the DL in that New Orleans playoff game and without anyone else stepping up to fill that disrupting 3T void alongside Linval/Pierce (Jaleel, Holmes, Mata'afa, Shamar - all have been disappointments thus far), having Griffin at the 3T for 1 yr while Watts & Lynch get more experience would have been preferred. At the very least, Griffin could have been a moveable vet depth piece along the DL for 1 season that could play inside and outside while still allowing younger players some snaps, and in doing so I would have released Shamar and his 2020 cap hit because Shamar doesn't provide anything more than Jaleel, Watts and Mata'Afa would provide. Griffin played well to start 2019 and then faded a bit down the stretch to come on again in New Orleans....I would have paid what Dallas did to have him as a rotational DL depth piece on the inside and outside....it would be interesting to see if that's the vision Zimmer had and Griffin wanted to purely play DE and if that's one of the reasons he chose Dallas... ...but I do find it somewhat surprising that even w/ Zimmer seemingly in the negotiating mix the last few days that the Vikings couldn't seal the deal...to me, that's pretty telling...
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Odin
Purp1eOne
Winning
Jarl (15,175)
Feb 3, 2017
Valhalla
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Post by Purp1eOne on Aug 13, 2020 10:26:46 GMT -6
Uncle , I'll take your view if the Vikings would have signed him for the same contract I think while Griffen would have helped the team because he still has something left in the tank and he is familiar with the system, and with a shortened off-season that will be a factor, they may have been better off letting the younger guys play this year to build the team going forward. The Vikings defense was already on the decline last year with a younger version of Griffen and more proven CBs even though they had a down year. With the Vikings going the youth movement route for many of the other positions on the D and while Griffen is still effective he will probably take a step back from last year which he wasn't as dominate as the previous year. Factoring in the possible injury increase because of his age and a position where he is in the trenches on almost every play the money could have been spent in other places to help the team for the future. To be clear, I only wanted him back to play along the interior because I do agree that I want Odenigbo (ie, younger players) to get the lion's share of the DE reps opposite Hunter. I really thought Zimmer found something in having Griffin rushing from inside the DL in that New Orleans playoff game and without anyone else stepping up to fill that disrupting 3T void alongside Linval/Pierce (Jaleel, Holmes, Mata'afa, Shamar - all have been disappointments thus far), having Griffin at the 3T for 1 yr while Watts & Lynch get more experience would have been preferred. At the very least, Griffin could have been a moveable vet depth piece along the DL for 1 season that could play inside and outside while still allowing younger players some snaps, and in doing so I would have released Shamar and his 2020 cap hit because Shamar doesn't provide anything more than Jaleel, Watts and Mata'Afa would provide. Griffin played well to start 2019 and then faded a bit down the stretch to come on again in New Orleans....I would have paid what Dallas did to have him as a rotational DL depth piece on the inside and outside....it would be interesting to see if that's the vision Zimmer had and Griffin wanted to purely play DE and if that's one of the reasons he chose Dallas... ...but I do find it somewhat surprising that even w/ Zimmer seemingly in the negotiating mix the last few days that the Vikings couldn't seal the deal...to me, that's pretty telling...
He would have been good for depth but having him on the inside I think caught the saints off guard more than anything else and if they tried to move inside more often he wouldn't be as effective. He is not going to be a run stopper which is what they really need and the one they signed took the year off.
I remember when all the coaches were departing and many thought they wanted to get away from Zimmer which turned out to be just the opposite. From the outside looking in all anyone is doing is guessing. For all we know he just wanted a change of scenery because the cops are being defunded and he doesn't feel safe anymore in Minneapolis.
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